NationStates Jolt Archive

I'm looking for a suitable "battleship buff" to design a navy for my nation, which is (roughly) at the 1900-1914 technology level. According to my backstory, Ferrana took a pounding in the Spanish-American war of 1898, losing most of it's ships to the American Navy in the Pacific (Ferrana being a sub-continent in the North Pacific).

I've identified three main types of operations the Navy needs to be able to perform, which are shore bombardment, fleet action (likely against the American fleet in the Pacific - in my timeline tensions between Ferrana and America are running high in the pre-War years), and commerce raiding (those Americans again. And the British. And that upstart Prussia).

For this I'll need (I think - feel free to correct me, as this isn't my area of expertise) a "stock" battleship for multirole stuff, a faster battlecruiser, a heavier dreadnought (dreadnaught?), and various cruisers and frigates and similar, which I'm not so sure about. Possibly an autogyro-carrying carrier too. Anti-aircraft stuff would probably be light, as Ferrana relies upon a (relitavely) more advanced air force to provide air superiority.

If anyone would like to try their hand at designing these ships for me, please do so, and you can have a capital ship named after you or something (within reason, of course. The Imperium must have it's dignitas, after all).

Try Jane's Fighting Ships of WWI.

Hrrm ... where might I find that?

Hrrm ... where might I find that?

A Public Library of moderate size, or a Book Store. If I was close enough to you, I'd loan you MY copy. Anyhow, it contains many WWI Navies. England. Japan. Germany. Even small nations, like the Dutch Royal Netherlands I believe.

Hmm ... I'll have to stop by the library tomorrow. Thanks for that!

Hmm ... I'll have to stop by the library tomorrow. Thanks for that!

No problem. I hope it helps you out :D.

or you could TGram Iansisle right now...I swear, this guy knows more about pre WWII naval combat then anyone I know...

That's a neat idea too ... but, you see, Iansisle's plans for the Pacific conflict with mine. I wouldn't want to be given a rubber ducky with a rubber-band catapult for a battleship ... although that would be cool. A giant rubber ducky (of D00M, of course) sailing along within a flotilla of other craft ... but I digress.

That's a neat idea too ... but, you see, Iansisle's plans for the Pacific conflict with mine. I wouldn't want to be given a rubber ducky with a rubber-band catapult for a battleship ... although that would be cool. A giant rubber ducky (of D00M, of course) sailing along within a flotilla of other craft ... but I digress.

I prefer the Enormous Teddy Bear of TERROR(Of course).

Hes good about keeping OOC seperate from IC, and Im sure hed help regardless.

I prefer the Enormous Teddy Bear of TERROR(Of course).

Unfortunately, teddy bears don't float all that well. Although there was a previous Imperator named Theodore, actually ... T-class steam submarines, anybody? I'm rather a fan of the British K-class subs, even if they did kill more British sailors than German.

Hes good about keeping OOC seperate from IC, and Im sure hed help regardless.

Hmm. I may just do that, then.

Well, I certainly hope I can live up to the glowing introduction Imitora gave me ;).

I don't think I know nearly as much about naval warfare as several people on this board, but I'm more than willing to help! And, like Imitora said, I try my absolute best not to let IC opinions/goals dictate my OOC actions. Hell, I held strategy sessions with D.K. about how best he could harass my convoys and government.

There's a few really good websites out there on these sorts of topics; you can find most of them by entering 'battleship' to google or the name of a specific one you want to look up. For tactics of the time period, I reccomend either WWI battles, like Dogger Bank, Jutland, etc. (of course ;)) or the Russo-Japanese war (if you're going for the whole pre-Dreadnought thing). The courses of these wars/battles tends to be fairly well documented, and often available in convinient novelized form.

Is there anything specific I can help you with?

Well, you know better than I how it all goes together, I guess. If I tried my hand at designing a Ferranan battleship it would probably end up so's it rolled over whenever you poked it or something.

And I guess I know even less about the lighter end of the scale, the frigates and cruisers and the like.

I'm not entirely after the whole Pre-Dreadnought era, but it makes sense to have some lighter versions along with the leviathans, no?

Definitely time to do some more reading. Google is my friend.

Edit: Also, numbers. What sort of numbers should I have for my fleet? How many ships of each type? That sort of thing.

Just base your numbers off real life ones, and you can't go wrong - trust me. Don't sweat total reality too much when designing your own ships; as long as they're semi-reasonable, people won't mind.

As for total fleet numbers, you can take a look at other countries of the time period with similar spending priorities and population. Are you more like the UK, Germany, or the Netherlands? Austria-Hungary, Russia, or Spain? Italy, France, or Sweden? You can find total numbers for most of these countries online; then just modify them for your own purposes.

Ooh, I think I shall keep an eye on this.
Maybe one day New Eastgate will advance enough to care what other people in the Pacific are up to.. but will I tag with the right account? Nooo.

I'm half inclined to offer HMWS Royal Oak for sale- we could always strip the radar and [checks specs] oh, well the AA defence is prety laughable already. It'd be the most travelled ship on Nation States (having been a coal fired battleship sold by Iansisle to WoS and refitted as an oily battlecruiser), but for now, as you can probably tell, I'm suffering the effects of still-being-awake-at-nine-AM, and can't remember why I decided to drag out three letters so far.

The population is difficult, since it keeps growing, after all. Economically, the Imperial Navy probably absorbs a large portion of the military budget, which would be proportionally large, as Ferrana is somewhat militaristic.

Ferrana's a Powerhouse right now, but I intend to change that. Politically the naval situation is similar to that of the United States of the same period - Ferrana doesn't have a colonial empire to be held together by ships, but it *does* have to keep up with hostile foreign fleets and so on.

I think I'm going to have something similar to the American Connecticut-class for my "ship of the line", and a battlecruiser/pocket battleship (I have yet to find a decent range of stats to base it off) for commerce raiding and the like.

I'm finding it very hard to find useful numbers and so on on Google - clearly it's not my friend after all. Maybe I can find better stuff at the library tomorrow.

Warships1 is always your friend (http://www.warships1.com/US/USbb18-Conn.htm) ;)

As for the numerical issue...whatever you feel is right, I suppose. As long as it's not 196843546543543 battleships, you shouldn't be too bad off. Iansisle, for instance, has 5 battleships and 2 battlecruisers in service right now (with 4 more battleships c.50% complete, and 2 battleships and 2 battlecruisers planned) - of course, each ship of mine is three to four times the displacement of what you're talking about, and much more complicated. I wouldn't really raise an eyebrow if you claimed 5-10ish battleships, with perhaps a few on the yards. Remember, though, that the United Kingdom 'only' boasted 24 capital ships at the start of the Great War (and Germany 16).

Hey, Iansisle have you noticed that most of the ships and navies have been pulled off the Warships1 site. Now there are only a few american designs...

WoS has more or less set its population (around 50 million, with almost as many in the empire, which may leap a little in coming weeks and months), precisely because it was too damned confusing beforehand.. plus we've just attacked the US and if we had them outnumbered ten to one on top of the economic and technical edge, it'd be no fun. I dunno.. I think it's easier to do in obscure time periods where you're not usually facing twenty other nation states with a billion people each, all wanting to run you down. But that's just a suggestion from me, Mr.No-one-in-particular.

Out of curiosity (I'll leave you alone, in a minute, I promise! (nothing's crossed, you're crazy!)), I wonder if you plan to have your nation advance towards the modern era, or to remain pre modern.

It's not really important to your thread, I'm just nosey and have a Pacific nation (New Eastgate) currently experiencing the industrial revolution, and planning to advance to early C20th level technology in the near future.

Anyhoo, good luck/enjoy your searches and fleet-building.

(Yeah, I did notice that - from what I gather, they're just updating with the intention of replacing it sometime in the future. [/shrug])

I've been meaning to set a population for Iansisle for quite some time now - I just haven't been able to decide what I want it to be.

For some reason, the number 160 million keeps popping into my head (that's for the entire Commonwealth), plus another 150-220ish million for Iansislean Gallaga.

At least I know my proportions! - 43% for the Empire of the Shield, 20% Dianatran, 18% Gadsan, 10% Noropia, 8% Tharia/Sentry Island, and (irrelevently small number probably closer to zero than the supposed one per cent) for Troobodia.

Did this post have a point? I think it did when I started...oh well.

Thanks for the link!

I think I'd have at most five battleships, and at least that many battlecruisers (although those wouldn't be designed for slugfights - strictly for attacking slower and weaker targets, like shipping). Maybe an experimental carrier vessel of some sort.

Breaking that down nicely, that's three pre-Dreadnought Connecticut-style battleships, two post-Dreadnought battleships (and another under construction - the Imperial Navy cannot afford to rest upon it's laurels, after all), about five battlecruisers, roughly similar to the American Tennessee, and various smaller craft for escort and coastal patrol duties.

How's that for a numbers breakdown?

And then, of course, there's the zeppelins of the Imperial Air Legions ... damnit, hydrogen! Be a better lifting gas!

Yes, you're kindly making me feel better by ensuring that I'm not the only one dragging this chap's thread hoplessly off course. Many thanks :)

I don't know why WoS had to go and settle for the smallest bit of Gallaga.. unless it was just because I'd already established that we hadn't two pennies to rub together until 1802. I need more conscripts!

Anyway, yeah, I've always sort of felt Iansisle was probably two or three times bigger than WoS, population wise. I could have sworn I was going to expand on that. Oh well, time for tea.

[waves]

If you want a dreadnought, come to North Stoneham :D
Me, the Leader, used to live next to Portsmouth where the HMS Dreadnought was built. I could give you a few tips :lol:

And then, of course, there's the zeppelins of the Imperial Air Legions ... damnit, hydrogen! Be a better lifting gas!

Well, when you're talking to myself and WoS, there's always plenty of hot air floating about ;)

As for the numbers, I think they look more than realistic! Maybe the battlecruisers are a little high - remember that those were, as a concept, at least as new as all-big gun designs. Still, looking good!

Anyway, yeah, I've always sort of felt Iansisle was probably two or three times bigger than WoS, population wise.

And I've always felt WoS was probably six or seven times more efficient than Iansisle. Last nation, even in the NS world, around to use press gangs? We probably are!

Hmm ... I wasn't so sure about that number. I'd been calculating that one ship takes three years to build, and that there were enough shipyards to build at least two ships at once, which gave me ten ships in the period of 1898-1914.

And they are smaller than battleships, after all, and there is an arms race going on with the Americans.

I'm thinking of having the battlecruisers modelled more upon the Japanese ones, which seem to have better speed than the American ones - and speed is everything, in the uses to which I plan to put them.

Remember, if they come up against a battleship they're essentially scrap.

I must find my submarine books - I want Iron Fish of D00M, damnit! When they get the kinks ironed out, the Ferranans are going to love those things.

Well, that does seem to make sense. Besides, there's no saying you didn't come up with the idea before Fisher did. (in my universe, Iansisle invented the jet engine, and the Germans stole it from us :( - and then WoS took all our ideas and made them ultra better! Not that I'm bitter - just my characters are.)

As for submarines, afraid I'll be no help there...I don't know anything about them at all.

In your battlecruisers, look out - if you are going for the speed over armor approach, don't make the mistakes of Jutland and the Denmark Strait.

EDIT: Never mind, I just noticed you said in your post that you won't!

Not to worry, I won't. :) I imagine that Naval Command has the battlecruiser captains and battleship captains all fighting over who gets the new hulls.

I know enough about submarines, I think (for which I have to thank my dad).

And it appears that I made a mistake when I said that battlecruisers are smaller; they're not by all that much. The Connecticut class (18 knots) weighs out at 17,665 tons, while the Ibuki (21.5 knots) is 15,595 tons and the Tsukuba (20.5 knots) is 15,400 tons.

Mind you, the American Lexington class is over twice those, at 44,638 tons ... but the darn thing goes 33 knots. Maybe I can pile on the steam turbines and get the Ferranan battlecruiser class up to 25 knots.

Well, be careful there. If my memory of coal-steam powered turbines is correct, you eventually reach a point where each new boiler isn't really even carrying its weight. I think it has something to do with the shaft horsepower. Alcona and Hubris would be better qualified to talk about this than me; engines aren't a specialty of mine, and he knows what he's talking about.

The main difference between battlecruisers and battleships is that the 'cruisers don't carry as much armor (British philosophy) or as big of guns (German); the resulting weight save combines with more powerful engines to give the higher speeds. Really, they're about as big as the average battleship.

Well, be careful there. If my memory of coal-steam powered turbines is correct, you eventually reach a point where each new boiler isn't really even carrying its weight. I think it has something to do with the shaft horsepower. Alcona and Hubris would be better qualified to talk about this than me; engines aren't a specialty of mine, and he knows what he's talking about.

The main difference between battlecruisers and battleships is that the 'cruisers don't carry as much armor (British philosophy) or as big of guns (German); the resulting weight save combines with more powerful engines to give the higher speeds. Really, they're about as big as the average battleship.

Well, there was a major change in design for the Lexington class. The creation of small tube boilers allowed less boilers for the same amount of steam generation, which explains why there are actually two designs for the lexigntons. In reality the Americans just went to the fast battleship (the Iowa's) and never really did design a battlecruiser in the traditional sense...the Lexingtons were more formally 'scout' battleships designed to scout ahead and resist all attempts to stop them locating the enemy fleet.

(It's nice to have access to a naval library at times...)

I've figured that out by now. Hrrm. Ah well, 21 knots should be enough for commerce raiding ... thank goodness I'm not silly enough to use submarines in combined maneuvers with the fleet, like the British. That's why they built the K-class subs, to keep up with the surface fleet. I think I'll stick to diesel subs, which take about an eighth of the the time to submerge. :)

Well, I've got the Connecticut and Tsukuba stats now. I shall proceed to alter them a bit before renaming them and sticking them into the Imperial Navy. Still got cruisers and those two Dreadnoughts to do...

Apart from escorting other warships, what exactly are cruisers for?

Edit: Didn't see that post of yours, A&H. Presuming the Ferranans have those small-tube boilers, what sort of speeds could I get a battlecruiser of around 15,000 tons up to?

Cruisers are used for all the odds and ends that capital ships are too big for and destroyers too small. Long range patrols, scouting for the battlefleet, escorting convoys, commerce raiding, showing the flag about the world, quick raids: that sort of thing.

Edit: Didn't see that post of yours, A&H. Presuming the Ferranans have those small-tube boilers, what sort of speeds could I get a battlecruiser of around 15,000 tons up to?

Actually use of those boilers would free up space and some displacement for other things, like more fuel capacity. Realize that some of those WWI designs were fairly limited in range and your stuck in the Pacific...a very big ocean

Unfortunatly the three major aspects affecting speed are displacement, hull design, and horsepower out of the turbines. Since the new boilers are heavier than the old, but more efficent you get a fairly low change or a slight reduction in displacement, more space inside of the 'citidel' or armored box of the ship to place important subsystems, and longer ranges for the same amount of fuel. Of course this comes at cost, those boilers are more expensive to build and maintain...

But if we are going to resurrect a battlecruiser. May I suggest the British G3...I've manipulated the into a 'modern' battlecruiser...but it does have a nice profile.
http://www.eng.auburn.edu/users/donatgw/g3-t.gif
(He he...Ahh finding a picture of a ship that was never built...not mine but I have to host it for you to see it :P )

Hrrm. Maybe I should sacrifice a few of those battlecruiser slots for additional battleships, and use the cruisers instead for that role.

So with those turbines I'd get a slight increase in speed, somewhat more space, and an increased range? That's not to be sneezed at.

Unfortunately, the G3 is A) outside of the timerange I'm looking at (although it might make a good ship for the next generation of craft, unless it gets skipped entirely to keep up with the Iansisleans), and B) Displaces more than my dreadnoughts (or at least more than they likely will. It's hard to find a good dreadnought to sponge off).

Heh ... pondering a catamaran ... what would that be like, in performance terms? (although it would be a future design, not in the current fleet)

Hrrm ... no replies? Ah well, here's the proposed stats for the Ferranan Dreadnought design (based off the British Orion). Feel free to correct me if I get anything horribly unworkable - in fact, I encourage you to.

Lyonesse class Dreadnought

Displacement: 25,000 tons
Length: 180 meters
Propulsion: 18 boilers with four shafts (from what I've read, I think that's drive shafts. Same number of propellers?), generating 27,000 horsepowers. Top speed 21 knots.
Crew: 750
OMG TEH WEPPINS:
- 5 turrets with dual 35 cm (14-and-a-bit inches) guns, all on the centerline, two before and three behind the conning tower, elevated so they don't interfere with each other.
- 14 10 cm (4-and-a-bit inches) guns, seven along each side.
- 4 submerged torpedo tubes, two on either side of the hull facing forwards (I really must find that book on submarines, and read the section on torpedoes).
Armour: 25 cm (ten-and-a-bit inches) belt, 5 cm (two-and-a-bit inches) decks, 20 cm (eight-and-a-half-or-something-like-that inches) turrets, 22 cm (nine-and-a-bit inches) conning tower.

OOC: I'll need to look at the orginal stats...

OOC: Well, I got them here (http://www.hazegray.org/navhist/battleships/rn_dr.htm).

Any thoughts on the catamaran idea?

Displ: 22,200 tons normal; 25,870 tons full load
Dim: 581 x 88 x 25 feet
Prop: Steam turbines, 18 boilers, 4 shafts, 27,000 hp, 21 knots
Crew: 752
Arm: 5 dual 13.5/45, 16 single 4/50, 3 21 inch TT sub
Armor: 8-12 inch belt, 1-4 inch decks, 3-10 inch barbettes, 11 inch
turrets, 11 inch CT
New design with larger main guns and all turrets on the centerline

Same design really...

I've been screwing around with the concept of a catamaran battleship...but there are several 'problems' I can't quite work out in my mind...my present work on armored ships is here...here (http://s2.invisionfree.com/The_FKC/index.php?showtopic=155) My major character is Landgravine Hubris...

Yeah, it's pretty much the same ... I didn't want to go too wild and end up with something that floats upside down. I'll probably be more adventurous with the other classes - I was originally planning to give the thing six dual 35cm turrets instead of five, but I wasn't sure how that would throw off the displacement and so on.

After reading up some more, I've come to the conclusion that building a battlecruiser class dedicated to commerce raiding is uneconomical. Thus, I've scrapped the class, and that role will be performed by cruisers (which ought to be just as good at taking out unarmed, non-convoyed vessels) and submarines (which ought to be even better - and the good diesel engines the Air Force has to have will make them rather good, too).

I then went on to organise my battleship production, and (using the two-ships-every-three-years rule of thumb) I've come to a more logical fleet;

- Four pre-Dreadnoughts (with turrets arranged hexagonally, the two heavy ones at fore and aft and the secondary turrets at the sides. Several German battleships had this arrangement).

- Two "early" Dreadnoughts (built at the start of the Dreadnought race, and essentially upscaled versions of the pre-Dreadnought. The turrets of these will also be arranged hexagonally, which allows a broadside of four turrets at most - a flaw which shall be corrected later).

- Two "advanced" Dreadnoughts (based upon the Orionesque stats above - but I am going to give it six turrets, arranged down the centerline).

- Two more "advanced" Dreadnoughts under construction (of the same class).

Those numbers give me four Dreadnoughts and four pre-Dreadnoughts, putting Ferrana equal to France or Italy in the Dreadnought stakes but a folorn last in total numbers; of the great powers, Ferrana has the same number of battleships as Russia (but, thankfully, beats them in quality - the Russians had no Dreadnoughts at all!). Ah well, I can't argue with the math.

I had pondered giving the advanced Dreadnoughts landing pads for autogyros, to help with spotting, but that would require rather too much deck space. I may convert a cruiser, as the British did with the HMS Furious; autogyros have the advantage that they take less space to land or take off. For now, I'll simply assign a zeppelin to the fleets for that.

Which brings me to another point - cruisers. Nothing I've found gives me the relitave numbers of non-capital craft for each of the Great Powers, or how long it takes to build them. Argh.

And some more stuff ... this is the Davidsburg class battleship. As always, feel free to correct me if I do anything unworkable, or especially if I do anything really stupid.

Davidsburg class battleship

Displacement: 18,000 tons
Length: 140m
Propulsion: 15 boilers, two shafts, 20,000 hp. Top speed 19 knots.
Crew: 800
Armament: 2x dual 25cm (10.4") turrets fore and aft, 4x dual 20cm (8.3") turrets (two port, two starboard - turrets in hexagonal arrangement), 14x 15cm (6.25") guns in barbettes (seven on each side), 10x 10cm (4.1") guns.
Armour: 20cm (8.3") belt tapering to 10cm (4.1") at ends, 7cm (2.9") deck, 25cm (10.4") main turrets and conning tower, 20cm (8.3") secondary turrets and barbettes.

Now obsolete due to the advent of Dreadnought-class ships, but still an integral part of the Ferranan navy due to lack of ships. Ships of the Davidsburg class are Davidsburg, Holyoke, Providence, and New Dover.

Aaand here's another, the Norton class Dreadnought.

Norton class Dreadnought
Displacement: 20,000 tons
Length: 140m
Propulsion: 20 boilers, steam turbines, 4 shafts, 25,000 hp. Top speed 21 knots.
Crew: 850
Armament: 6x dual 30cm (12.5") turrets (in hexagonal arrangement), 16x 15cm (6.25") guns in barbettes (eight a side), 10x 10cm (4.1") guns.
Armour: 25cm (10.4") belt tapering to 15cm (6.25") at ends, 7cm (2.9") deck, 25cm (10.4") turrets and conning tower, 20cm (8.3") barbettes.

Now obsolete due to more advanced designs, the Norton was designed to counter the British Dreadnought and other early Dreadnoughts. It is essentially a heavier version of the Davidsburg class. Ships of the Norton class are Norton and Redstone.

And now for the pride of the Imperial Navy ...

Fletcher class Dreadnought

Displacement: 25,000 tons
Length: 180m
Propulsion: 20 boilers, steam turbines, 4 shafts, 27,000 hp. Top speed 20 knots.
Crew: 900-1,000
Armament: 6x dual 35cm (14.5") turrets (arranged down the centerline, three fore and three aft), 22x dual 15cm (6.25") guns, 4x 50cm (21.4") torpedo tubes (submerged).
Armour: 30cm (12.5") belt tapering to 15cm (6.25") at ends, 10cm (4.1") deck, 25cm (10.4") turrets and barbettes, 30cm (12.5") conning tower.

The most advanced ship in the Imperial Navy, the Fletcher class Dreadnought finally eliminates the hexagonal turret arrangement, allowing the ships to fire all their turrets in a single broadside. The consolidation of the secondary armaments into one type is and aid to logistics and fire control (because fire control officers don't have to distinguish between 15cm and 10cm shell hits). Ships of the Fletcher class are Fletcher and New Petersburg, with Misennigat and Hastings under construction.

According to this book I have, the tally for the great battleship race in 1914 was:

[code:1:3ff2180bbc]Country Capital Ships Cruisers Destroyers
Great Britain 24 91 155
Germany 16 41 88[/code:1:3ff2180bbc]

It's not a specifically naval history book, though, so you might want to be wary of these numbers.

Hrrm. In that case, somewhere around 25 cruisers and 50 destroyers should be about right. No?

Yup, sounds good to me. Oh, which reminds me! Year Two of my naval buildup is probably just about over! *runs off to update factbook thread*

And Iansisle draws still further ahead of little me ... yowch. Ah well, I will at least have a better submarine force than you! Nyah!

Any thoughts on the Battleships above?

They look good, actually. Reasonable; perhaps a little powerful for the time they were designed, but I don't think anyone'll complain about that ;).

EDIT: Yeah, darn submarines. Don't know anything about them; I find it's easier just to (try and) ignore them...not that D.K.'d let me! *shakes fist*

That's ok then. Compared to what they're up against, they're rather underpowered. Eeek.

Submarines are cool. Just as soon as I find that book of mine, I'm going to design a few. And then ... all your bases are belong to us! Mwahahahaha!

I must design those cruisers, too. I want to convert one to an autogyro carrier.

(Uh oh, I'm going to ramble!)

I think I needed this. I was feeling terribly bored with everything, even NS (gasp)! The RWN needs sorting out.. I've just skipped ahead a couple of years and not built any ships that weren't laid down probably months before the war ended several years back. Considering we've been planning Re-vere (I must have been drunk when I came up with that) since the 30s I suppose it's fair to assume WoS wouldn't really have slacked off like that. Although I suppose that damn afterburner technology probably took a bite out of the Admiralty's budget increases.

Submarines. Hm. I can well see Sir Henry sending minions to Ferrana when we catch on to their submarine advantage. WoS has only one class of U-boat, the A-Class -hated by all who sail on her. Not to mention by most of the Admiralty, Parliament, and the public.

(Displacement:997tons surfaced, 1,502 submerged
Length-272ft
Beam-26ft
Draught-11ft 10in
Speed-15kt surfaced, 9kt submerged
Armament-one 4in deck gun, two .303mg, eleven 21in tubes; eight forward, two amidships, one aft; 17 torpedoes all told
Complement-59)

Anyhoo, the new ships are interesting, Ferrana. I wondered if they were a bit light for the numbers of guns on some of them, but I don't really know what I'm talking about, and I don't suppose it matters much anyway- they're still relatively slow, regardless. While -as one would expect of a more advanced nation- most WoS capital ships would probably expect to pick them off with good radar fire control and 15" or 15.5" guns, and could outrun them if not, I think we'd be more than a little keen to avoid getting within range of their full batteries. Range and accuracy aside, we don't have anything that could throw so many big shells in a broadside. I expect they'd be a bit handy in coastal bombardment.

Yay for figures and statistics!

Hm, currently we appear to have as many battleships as the Ians (5), but they have 6 building or planned. I don't know if we can afford any more Glamorgans.

For anyone interested, the last recorded WoS Combined Fleets Totals read as such:
Ships- Battleships- 5, Aircraft Carriers- 7, Battlecruisers- 5, Heavy Cruisers- 11, Light Cruisers- 8, Destroyers- 14, Corvettes- 16, Submarines- 22
Aircraft- 321
Ship’s and Air Crew- 47,314

Holy God-on-Ceylopium*, you can see that we didn't traditionally hold much fear of our merchants being attacked (which throws some doubt on the, "war on piracy" angle..)

Considering that we're an intercontinental-empire-holding island nation in the British tradition, with around 50 million people in the home nation and a more powerful economy than the likes of Britain or Germany ever maintained for long, I think I've some work to do.. Hurrah!
([glances at Iansisle's factbook] Looks like I need more carriers! :shock: )

Ahem, sorry, I'll take this to one of my own threads :)

(*Brand name Ceyloban-made opiate popular in WoS and her Empire)

Glad to be of help!

Yeah, the dreadnoughts are a bit heavy in firepower - but remember, the Ferranans need as much seapower as possible, as fast as possible. They've got a limit on the number of hulls they can build at one time, so naturally they make the things as heavily armed as possible, and try to win through superior firepower instead of numbers.

You know, my subs are probably stronger than yours. Four tubes can be arranged nicely on the bows, but six or more mean you have to have an oval-shaped hull, and that decreases the hull strength. Although you *could* have some tubes in the casing (I plan to have two).

In performance terms, my planned "less advanced" model, based heavily on the British E-class, is pretty similar to your A-class. Of course, just by streamlining the "advanced" model is faster and quieter. :)

So, without further ado, here's the ...

Fletcher Boat Yards Type III* submersible

Displacement: 650 tons surface, 800 tons submerged
Length: 55 meters (a bit more than 180 feet)
Beam: 7.5 meters (a bit more than 24 feet)
Draught: 4 meters (a bit more than 13 feet)
Propulsion: Monserrat diesel engines providing 2,000 hp, Naval Design Bureau electric motors providing 1,000 hp, two screws.
Top speed surfaced 17 knots, submerged 10 knots.
Armament: 4x 50cm tubes at bow, 2x 50cm tubes in bow casing (note that casing tubes tend to be less accurate, and cannot be serviced from within the boat). 1x 6kg gun (a bit heavier than a 12-pounder) on forward casing, 1x 8mm Kellenso machine gun on rear casing.
Crew: 30
Notes: The Type III is equipped with a schnorkel to allow it to use it's diesels at periscope depth (with caution - this can be dangerous). It is also very noisy - the casing flowholes and the protruberances on the casing itself cause turbulence and noise (not to mention increasing drag), and the Monserrat diesels do put out a lot of low-frequency sound (although they're quieter than the foreign equivalents, since they've got a higher RPM). But it's not like hydrophones are good enough to pick that up, right? Right? (post-WWII sensors should be able to hear the things easily).
As a saddleback-type submarine, the Type III handles reasonably well on the surface, though not quite so well as a double-hull. It's still inferior to pretty much everything else on the surface.

*The Type III is, as the name suggests, the third submarine class to be produced for the Imperial Navy. The Type I has been decommisioned, as have most of the Type II (although I plan to have a few as converted minelayers). The Type IV, which I've not yet made the stats for, will be configured for faster speed and stealth.

I'd be very tempted to build a couple of subs similar to the British M-class, if it wasn't for the fact that in practice it's not that effective.

Hey, Iansisle have you noticed that most of the ships and navies have been pulled off the Warships1 site. Now there are only a few american designs...

mine are really all based off Japanese ones, except for a few insane British ones... a destroyer with a single 18" gun forwards? thats a nice one :P