NationStates Jolt Archive

At the risk of sounding like a newbie, I need help. my space fleet in in serius need up an upgrade. It's been in the same condition since.....October at least.

I have already been advised by a few other space powers about how big my fleet should be, but one guy is a conservative, and the other guy is limited to the Sol System.

They both said 600 ships (not counting fighters) is good, but I need more opinions. Please keep in mind that I have over 1.7 billion people in my nation, and have a Frightning Economy

Is size all that you need advice on?

Do you have pictures of your ships?

Perhaps you should post your fleet...

http://www.freewebs.com/atlantian_outcasts/Atlantis.bmp
Titan Battleship
Oblisk Fighters: 50 wings (3 fighters per wing)
Scarab Shuttles: 5
15 Orcalic Phaser beams
25 Plasma Burst Cannons
2 Ion beams
Sheilds
Orcalic Ablative Armor
Personnel: 3,000 (4,000 Maximum)

http://www.pacifier.com/~cziller/pyramid2.jpg
Pyramid Cruser
Oblisk fighters: 25 wings
Scarab Shuttles: 3
10 Orcalic Phaser Beams
15 Plasma Burst Cannons
Sheilds
Orcalic Ablative Armor
Personnel: 1,000 (maximum)

http://www.freewebs.com/atlantian_outcasts/Oblisk%20Fighter.bmp
Oblisk Fighter
2 Orcalic Phaser Beams
Orcalic Ablative Armor
Personnel: 1 (2 maximum)

http://www.freewebs.com/atlantian_outcasts/AO%20ship.bmp
Barracuda Destroyer
Oblisk Fighters: 10 wings
5 Orcalic Phaser Beams
7 Plasma Burst Cannons
Sheilds
Ablative Armor

I have no info on the Scarab shuttle at this time....and I use civilian Cargo ships.

OOC-Wow, flying Geo-metric Shapes...
They look decent in size, so I would uggest 600.


BUT, You need to look at your stats again. What is the point in having 3 classes of ship which all have the same weaponry? Its like having 10 Million Ground Forces all armed with M-16's, and sending them to battle a mixed array of tanks, infantry and air units.
Just my thoughts.

600 should be right...you tech is....VERY outdated though...

We're not big on the whole lots-of-weak-ships thing. We make a few powerful ones, and build battlegroups off of them.

Even though we are not at our full force right now, I'd say we have somewhere around 80 ships that are over 200m. Nothing bigger than a mile long.

If you want to do some shopping at my storefront, we have package-deal battlegroups for 1 trillion USD.

http://www.bateshome.com/jordan/ccsig.jpg (http://www.bateshome.com/jordan/ccdex.htm)

BUT, You need to look at your stats again. What is the point in having 3 classes of ship which all have the same weaponry? Its like having 10 Million Ground Forces all armed with M-16's, and sending them to battle a mixed array of tanks, infantry and air units.
Just my thoughts.

because they all have different amounts of weaponry, and different amounts of manuverability. Interesting Idea though.

Steel: see, I told you I was outdated!

What kind of weaponry would you 2 suggest?

If you want to keep some level of respect, then it is best not to go over 500 combat ships total, and none over 1km long. Thats combat ships, not support ship (refuelers/tankers, supply ships, tenders, hospital ships, etc.).

Personally, I make due with fewer then 100 combat ships between 30 and 350 meters in length (nothing larger)...but then, my nation is rather extreme in it's preference in quality over quantity.

If your going to make a fleet, then there are some basic things you want to consider.

1: What is the fleet going to do? Dreadnaughts are not too useful for escorting merchant ships, and frigates aren't that great for orbital invasion. Designing your ships as well as your fleets to do specific missions (and not others) is both more realistic, and makes them better able to fullfill their roles.

2: What are the technologies involved? I suggest picking 1-3 (if you want GREAT technologies), or 4-6 (if you want ships average in most areas), or up to 10 (if you like cardboard). The fewer technologies you choose, the more flavor your ships have. Example: Menelmacari Gravships concentrate on gravitic (obviously) and plasma technologies.

3: What are the limits? Limits are what define our nations, vehicles, and characters. What fun is a ship that can do everything instantly? Give your characters hurdles to overcome. Make your ships unique. Make sure you have limits.

4: What do you consider godmoding? Is a nanotech repairing hull godmoding? Tactical FTL? Phasers, grasors, farrad systems, and other non-real-life weapons? Ask yourself where you draw the line, and don't cross it.

5: How much physics do you know? If you don't know much, then forget putting in absolute speeds, power levels, hull plating, etc. Example: Siri has NEVER said how fast her gravships are in space, nor how much damage her plasma weapons do. This has kept her safe from physics nerds such as myself. -- On the other hand, if you know a fair amount of physics, and your willing to do the calculations and the research, go ahead and base your ships on real-world stuff (only ocassionally bending or breaking rules/laws).

Hope all that helps!

-The Cardboard Avenger

[OOC: blah...get out of here!

He's my trade partner...not your customer! :evil:

Now...as I said AO...your tech is very outdated. I believe that I could adapt some of my technology to your ships's specs. However, I'd have to wonder what you would offer me in return. It doesn't have to be military-oriented either.]

Whats your weapons ranges?

On another note, CC really only has about 40 Battlegroups. As wazzu said, we prefer Quality over Quantity. The average CC Cruiser is just about 800m long, well in optimal dimensions. It's power is unmmatched for a ship of its sized, and it can run well on a skeleton crew.

We have an active military of less than like .08%, and we're at war!

But, of course, Wazzu plays a bit different game than most of us, but I don't wanna get into that... again :P

Don't listen to wazzu's the more technology you have, the worse they will all work. However, most of the other things he said is excellent advice.

As wazzu said, we prefer Quality over Quantity.

There is nothing that says you cannot have both :idea:

Hey dude I would contact Nanakaland he supplied most of my fleet and its really good. He has great ships at pretty good prices.

BUT, You need to look at your stats again. What is the point in having 3 classes of ship which all have the same weaponry? Its like having 10 Million Ground Forces all armed with M-16's, and sending them to battle a mixed array of tanks, infantry and air units.
Just my thoughts.

because they all have different amounts of weaponry, and different amounts of manuverability. Interesting Idea though.

Steel: see, I told you I was outdated!

What kind of weaponry would you 2 suggest?

You didn't ask me, but I'll give a question in answer.

"Well, that depends, how realistic do you want to be?"


Don't listen to wazzu's the more technology you have, the worse they will all work. However, most of the other things he said is excellent advice.

AO, think of it this way. You have all basic ship systems. You also have 5 billion dollers to invest in R&D to make your technology better.

You can split it between plasma, lasers, particle beams, ion cannons, rail/gauss guns, gravitic-wank, nanobots, hull, shields, engines, powerplants, etc. etc. etc.

Or, you can pick just two.

Now, which will be better? The technology that you spent 500,000 on? Or the technology that you spent 2.5 billion on?

Having the best of everything is what every cardboard nation does. It is boring, unrealistic, and stupid. ICly, my nation takes it as if they spent that 5 billion on propaganda rather then R&D.

Pick a few and give your ships and fleets some character, some personality, some flavor, while giving your characters limits.

Afterall, you don't grow as a person unless you have obsticles to overcome.

As wazzu said, we prefer Quality over Quantity.

There is nothing that says you cannot have both :idea:lol well, money does, actually... You can either have a bunch of cheap ships, or a couple exensive ships.

Personally, I prefer 500-2500 billion dollar ships :)

As wazzu said, we prefer Quality over Quantity.

There is nothing that says you cannot have both :idea:lol well, money does, actually... You can either have a bunch of cheap ships, or a couple exensive ships.

Personally, I prefer 500-2500 billion dollar ships :)

But what do you mean by "extensive"...I tend not to think size defines a ship as "extensive" but instead the technology on board. So say I outfit my ships with all the technology I can, and still have a lot of money left over? Well...I build more ships. It doesn't mean they have any less quality as long as you have the money, and I do...

EDIT: Also, money to build ships in my nation is not like how it in in RL America. The government owns every step of the process, which drastically cuts down on the cost.

[OOC: blah...get out of here!

He's my trade partner...not your customer! :evil:

Now...as I said AO...your tech is very outdated. I believe that I could adapt some of my technology to your ships's specs. However, I'd have to wonder what you would offer me in return. It doesn't have to be military-oriented either.]

Well.....
*rumages though bag of goodies*
how about plans for the Morning Star V? Never been used by anyone but us. It can litter the ground with UV radiation from orbit in one mode, or it can open a hole in the Ozone (this second mode should only be used if you have been invaded and are on the verge of defeat)

Or...Orcalic. My favorite mystery metal. Not only can it be used for weaponry, but it also makes for nice decorations around the house, especaly when light from the sun hit's it.

We can also give you some Atlantian Ale. It's not as well known as Elearian Ale, but that's because it isn't releaced outside AO vey often

(I feel like Tsarist Russia right now)

Gore_2004: I don't buy ships from other people. I might buy tech, but not ships.

CC: no thanks

Wazzu: about as far tech as Kelnor or Steel. AO is ready to become a major power

Having the best of everything is what every cardboard nation does. It is boring, unrealistic, and stupid. ICly, my nation takes it as if they spent that 5 billion on propaganda rather then R&D.

Pick a few and give your ships and fleets some character, some personality, some flavor, while giving your characters limits.

Afterall, you don't grow as a person unless you have obsticles to overcome.

So I'm a cardboard nation, eh wazzu? :roll:

Granted I don't use everything that I come across, and nothing works perfectly 100% of the time...

Perhaps it's just two different styles. I let the storyline define the tech. It seem you're the other way around.

Wazzu: about as far tech as Kelnor or Steel. AO is ready to become a major power

Klonor and Steel aren't exactly major powers...more like major 3rd-world nations.

Of course, they would debate that, but most respected people in NS that actually role-play (rather then just dream up uberships they think are better then all the rest) wouldn't.

As wazzu said, we prefer Quality over Quantity.

There is nothing that says you cannot have both :idea:lol well, money does, actually... You can either have a bunch of cheap ships, or a couple exensive ships.

Personally, I prefer 500-2500 billion dollar ships :)

But what do you mean by "extensive"...I tend not to think size defines a ship as "extensive" but instead the technology on board. So say I outfit my ships with all the technology I can, and still have a lot of money left over? Well...I build more ships. It doesn't mean they have any less quality as long as you have the money, and I do...

EDIT: Also, money to build ships in my nation is not like how it in in RL America. The government owns every step of the process, which drastically cuts down on the cost.that was a typo, I meant "exPensive." Look at the context!

I'm not the type to have any big ships. Again, even my biggest flagship is less than a mile long. Most of my ships are star-trek-sized...

Wazzu: about as far tech as Kelnor or Steel. AO is ready to become a major power

Klonor and Steel aren't exactly major powers...more like major 3rd-world nations.

Of course, they would debate that, but most respected people in NS that actually role-play (rather then just dream up uberships they think are better then all the rest) wouldn't.

they sure seem to have alot of Influence :roll:

Wazzu: about as far tech as Kelnor or Steel. AO is ready to become a major power

Klonor and Steel aren't exactly major powers...more like major 3rd-world nations.

Of course, they would debate that, but most respected people in NS that actually role-play (rather then just dream up uberships they think are better then all the rest) wouldn't.

they sure seem to have alot of Influence :roll:Like I said man, Wazzu plays a little bit different game than the rest of us. He has a totally different concept of how NS should be played... and that's allright, NS is very open... but just don't listen to him when he wants to rant.

Heck, I just refuse to play that game. There are many NS games I refuse to play... I don't play with elves, I don't play with medieval tech, I don't play with people who have 20 ships that are 1000km long... I don't play against people who have Death Stars (unless they are NPCs)

Wazzu: about as far tech as Kelnor or Steel. AO is ready to become a major power

Klonor and Steel aren't exactly major powers...more like major 3rd-world nations.

Of course, they would debate that, but most respected people in NS that actually role-play (rather then just dream up uberships they think are better then all the rest) wouldn't.

You can't be serious... :lol:

That actually roleplay? LMAO...good lord. Check the archives, my good man, or...ask around. Obviously we haven't RPed together before...

but to call me a 3rd world nation who doesn't roleplay...wow...you know nothing at all.

You talk of the "most respected people in NS." Wazzu you're talking to one now. As for you, and not as an insult, but all that I've heard of you is your nazism regarding technology. That's not roleplaying, that's just proving you got a good grade in math and science.

Heck, I just refuse to play that game. There are many NS games I refuse to play... I don't play with elves, I don't play with medieval tech, I don't play with people who have 20 ships that are 1000km long... I don't play against people who have Death Stars (unless they are NPCs)

I have a small Elvish population, you just offended them :wink:

Steel: I'm still waiting for your response to my offer

Wazzu: about as far tech as Kelnor or Steel. AO is ready to become a major power

Klonor and Steel aren't exactly major powers...more like major 3rd-world nations.

Of course, they would debate that, but most respected people in NS that actually role-play (rather then just dream up uberships they think are better then all the rest) wouldn't.

they sure seem to have alot of Influence :roll:Like I said man, Wazzu plays a little bit different game than the rest of us. He has a totally different concept of how NS should be played... and that's allright, NS is very open... but just don't listen to him when he wants to rant.

It's not alright when he tells me, of all people, that I don't roleplay and that I'm nothing more than a 3rd world nation.

I apologize for sounding arrogant...but good lord...

Point me to some of your RP's, wazzu

Most of my ships are star-trek-sized...

Same here...most of my ships look like star trek ships :wink:

they sure seem to have alot of Influence :roll:

Obviously that doesn't matter to Wazzu :?

Most of my ships are star-trek-sized...

Same here...most of my ships look like star trek ships :wink:

STEEL! I NEED YOU TO RESPOND TO MY OFFER ON PAGE ONE!

Wazzu: about as far tech as Kelnor or Steel. AO is ready to become a major power

Klonor and Steel aren't exactly major powers...more like major 3rd-world nations.

Of course, they would debate that, but most respected people in NS that actually role-play (rather then just dream up uberships they think are better then all the rest) wouldn't.

they sure seem to have alot of Influence :roll:Like I said man, Wazzu plays a little bit different game than the rest of us. He has a totally different concept of how NS should be played... and that's allright, NS is very open... but just don't listen to him when he wants to rant.

It's not alright when he tells me, of all people, that I don't roleplay and that I'm nothing more than a 3rd world nation.

I apologize for sounding arrogant...but good lord...

Point me to some of your RP's, wazzuThe guy is always bashing me on the same stupid points. I have like 15 threads over a great ongoing RP campaign. Truthfully, I don't see him RPing as much as I do even...

Most of my ships are star-trek-sized...

Same here...most of my ships look like star trek ships :wink:

STEEL! I NEED YOU TO RESPOND TO MY OFFER ON PAGE ONE!

*takes a deep breath, smacks wazzu*

Morning Star V: I'm not really into doomsday weapons, unless they are the point or focus of an RP. I highly doubt that I (or you for that matter) could really use this on someone's planet during war without them shouting GODMOD. If you can get away with it, do it to earth, please. :wink:

Orcalic: I have my own "fake" metals...and while the decorations would be cool...it's not exactly a fair trade.

Atlantian Ale: As a people who love alcohol and (gasp!) respect it and don't abuse it, I'm sure that those of the Orion Sector would love to try the ale. However, like the Orcalic, I don't see it as an equal trade for such technology.

Most of my ships are star-trek-sized...

Same here...most of my ships look like star trek ships :wink:

STEEL! I NEED YOU TO RESPOND TO MY OFFER ON PAGE ONE!

*takes a deep breath, smacks wazzu*

Morning Star V: I'm not really into doomsday weapons, unless they are the point or focus of an RP. I highly doubt that I (or you for that matter) could really use this on someone's planet during war without them shouting GODMOD. If you can get away with it, do it to earth, please. :wink:

Orcalic: I have my own "fake" metals...and while the decorations would be cool...it's not exactly a fair trade.

Atlantian Ale: As a people who love alcohol and (gasp!) respect it and don't abuse it, I'm sure that those of the Orion Sector would love to try the ale. However, like the Orcalic, I don't see it as an equal trade for such technology.

MSV: I have used it once or twice in the 1st Mode. Sure, I've been ignored by some people (mostly people who still havn't forgotten my past as a n00b or don't accept Space tech)

Ok....do you want Ablative Armor? Or....well.....damn.....

:wink: have it

Keep trying, I want to help you...

I'll try to think of alternatives as well.

:wink: have it

Keep trying, I want to help you...

I'll try to think of alternatives as well.

(btw: I forgot, "Atlantian Ale" is actualy called Necter, sorry about that. I just havn't referenced to it since that royal wedding between Ajjenni and Elara)

Well....how about some Ambrosia to go with that Necter? (note: Ambrosia is actualy a Legal drug)

eh.....*continues to think*

Actually, it proves I got a grade in physics (whereas most people haven't any education in the area).

And I say you don't RP because I don't call Ravism or Bisonism or Mishakalism "Role-Play."

If you want to see some of my RP, do a simple search for "Wazzu." I've a lot of character-oriented RP on the NS forums. I also have some on the Mars forums and used to play quite a bit on the Lodoss boards (as Jynx).

And no Steel, you are neither a great nation, nor well respected...except perhaps among your fellow godmoders. *notes that Xanthal too has "n00bish" groupies*

I don't claim any such followers or superpower level myself. I just claim overwhelming quality of what I do have because I invest signifigant resources and RP time (NOT storefront threads, actual RP time) into a smaller amount of imaginary junk...

...and I flame those who I deserve need a good grilling...namely those who claim ultimate "futuretech" (read: "magictech godmodery") and "best nation/biggest superpower" status.

As such, when someone like Atlantian Outcasts comes along and wants guidence, I try to pursuade them to stay away from the script-kiddie type "uberwank" of nations of your ilk.

As such, when someone like Atlantian Outcasts comes along and wants guidence, I try to pursuade them to stay away from the script-kiddie type "uberwank" of nations of your ilk.

How dare you attempt to speak for me. I AM an "uberwank" (and I always have been), as you so bluntly put it. I have been involved in RP's with Xanthal, Phalinax, Kelnor, Lunatic Retard Robots, Zoir (who has been an EXTREAMLY good ally), etc.

I have no land that I own on earth, I have my population spread across several systems in a cluster that I own.

How DARE you.

As such, when someone like Atlantian Outcasts comes along and wants guidence, I try to pursuade them to stay away from the script-kiddie type "uberwank" of nations of your ilk.

How dare you attempt to speak for me. I AM an "uberwank" (and I always have been), as you so bluntly put it. I have been involved in RP's with Xanthal, Phalinax, Kelnor, Lunatic Retard Robots, etc.

I have no land that I own on earth, I have my population spread across several systems in a cluster that I own.

How DARE you.

This is how I dare.

At the risk of sounding like a newbie, I need help. my space fleet in in serius need up an upgrade. It's been in the same condition since.....October at least.

I have already been advised by a few other space powers about how big my fleet should be, but one guy is a conservative, and the other guy is limited to the Sol System.

They both said 600 ships (not counting fighters) is good, but I need more opinions. Please keep in mind that I have over 1.7 billion people in my nation, and have a Frightning Economy

You asked for advice, I dared to give my opinion. Obviously you don't like it. Next time perhaps you should add a qualifier? Maybe something like "I am looking for a magitech fleet like Mishakal, Xanthal, Klonor, or Angulus has."

You asked for advice, I dared to give my opinion. Obviously you don't like it. Next time perhaps you should add a qualifier? Maybe something like "I am looking for a magitech fleet like Mishakal, Xanthal, Klonor, or Angulus has."

And obviusly, your being a dick. I see no one here backing you up, mr. "I'm superior to everyone else here".

You didn't even quit when I mentiond that I aspired to be like Steel in terms of power. That should have been your que, but instead you begin to flame the people in this thread.

I might be a tad nieve when it comes to just how big everyone's fleet is, but I know what kinds of people I have RP'd with, and weather they are good at RP'ing or not. I am not a newbie, I am a vetran player. It is a shame that my nation was never too powerful, and I am going to rectify that problem. But you do NOT insult me, OR my allies

Actually, it proves I got a grade in physics (whereas most people haven't any education in the area).

No, it proves you give a shit. I took Acedemic and then AP physics in HS...but why should I have to incorporate them into my RP. I want my RP's to read like novels, not science books.

And I say you don't RP because I don't call Ravism or Bisonism or Mishakalism "Role-Play."

So give some proof that my RP's are similar to Mishakal? Back yourself up here.

If you want to see some of my RP, do a simple search for "Wazzu." I've a lot of character-oriented RP on the NS forums. I also have some on the Mars forums and used to play quite a bit on the Lodoss boards (as Jynx).

If you want some of my RP, look through the last five years of my life in various places and in various forms. No where that I've seen does anyone RP like you.

And no Steel, you are neither a great nation, nor well respected...except perhaps among your fellow godmoders. *notes that Xanthal too has "n00bish" groupies*

Then I am well respected as an RPer and a member of nationstates in every group except your's. Show me where I godmod, Wazzu, and take your time, because it will be hard to find. I've gotten compliments from Menelmacar and Melkor. I've gotten compliments from Slag and Angelus. I've gotten compliments from Nanakaland. I've gotten compliments from tons of other people. I'm respected by n00bs and vets alike. You don't seem to appreciate it because science wasn't my favorite subject in school. In fact, english was.

I don't claim any such followers or superpower level myself. I just claim overwhelming quality of what I do have because I invest signifigant resources and RP time (NOT storefront threads, actual RP time) into a smaller amount of imaginary junk...

My storefronts are for a change of pace. You cannot tell me that "realm of the risen," the warheit saga, or my civil war threads are not actual RP, and if you do, you obviously have no knowledge of what an RP is.

...and I flame those who I deserve need a good grilling...namely those who claim ultimate "futuretech" (read: "magictech godmodery") and "best nation/biggest superpower" status.

I don't claim "ultimate" future tech levels, I claim "far" future tech levels. My ships can be destroyed. Look at my civil war (where others are involved) for an example. I also have never said I'm a superpower, although others have. Personally, I don't think I'm there quite yet.

This is a political game, not a science one. I think to myself, who am I to tell you how to play though...however, as I don't insult "regional takeovers" or whatever, you have no need insult my story-driven RP, which you obviously have never read. Go read an instruction manual or something, wazzu, and grow the hell up.

AO: I insulted because others insulted me. I didn't quit because I find it hard to let people insulting me get the last word.



Steel: It should have been obvious from my first post, but I'll make it simple.

I don't have a problem with people who don't take physics into account. I have a problem with people who use pseudo-physics.

Example: "The Super-dreadnaught Markovitch fires its 1000 grasors at your fleet, each rated in the 500 Terrawatt range. Meanwhile, 10,000 200 gigaton missiles fly towards your fleet at 99% the speed of light, having appeared from hyperspace not far away. They will destroy everything within 10,000 kilometers."

Now, your welcome to play with magitech if you like, but claiming physics figures while claiming to want nothing to do with physics is hypocritical.



As for your RP, I haven't seen any of it. All I've seen is how you believe you can have the best of everything. And yes, what you have said in this thread pretty much amounts to that. Shall I quote?

AO: I insulted because others insulted me. I didn't quit because I find it hard to let people insulting me get the last word.



Steel: It should have been obvious from my first post, but I'll make it simple.

I don't have a problem with people who don't take physics into account. I have a problem with people who use pseudo-physics.

Example: "The Super-dreadnaught Markovitch fires its 1000 grasors at your fleet, each rated in the 500 Terrawatt range. Meanwhile, 10,000 200 gigaton missiles fly towards your fleet at 99% the speed of light, having appeared from hyperspace not far away. They will destroy everything within 10,000 kilometers."

Now, your welcome to play with magitech if you like, but claiming physics figures while claiming to want nothing to do with physics is hypocritical.



As for your RP, I haven't seen any of it. All I've seen is how you believe you can have the best of everything. And yes, what you have said in this thread pretty much amounts to that. Shall I quote?

The fact that you haven't read any of my RP's automatically makes point you have made had void. I don't claim physics beyond the most basic things and I don't believe I have the best of everything...however I purposefully play a very advanced nation, not a nation trying to be advanced. Because of this, I don't do war a lot, and don't try to throw my weight around. The triumvirate "wanks" all the time, yet rarely does anyone get on their case about it.

However, this argument isn't and has never been about me using "pseudo-physics" or actual physics, so you "making it simple" is only you taking it off topic.

In a thread designed by AO asking for advice, you threw insults at me like I was some godmodding n00b, and then when I called you on it, continued with your bastard rant about how my RP's suck and no one gives me respect...only to say now that you've never read them.

AO, the creator of this thread, has said you are not wanted here. Unwanted posts are called spam. Take yourself and your spam elsewhere.

Peace gentlemen, Peace, it's a simple, unspoken fact that Wazzu is a member of the Hard Science Fiction community, and thus likes to play with others who follow Hard Sci Fi. Does that mean that Wazzu is right and people who don't do hard sci fi are heathens that need to burn at the stake for thier sins? No, it simply means that we put more emphasis on the Fiction than on the Science. Neither are inherantly wrong, or inherantly right, and both have upsides to them, but in the end it all boils down to one simple question. Are you having fun?

It's a game, and nothing more, which is a point a lot of people forget here, and like all games, it boils down to wether or not it's fun to play. Wazzu has fun playing in a more realistic sence, and working out physicis explainations for everything he wants to do, and that's fine for him. I on the other hand would prefer to have fantastic starships that could NEVER exist, play around with things that simply are too fantastic to ever be possible, and generaly don't have any alms bending the laws of physics to my whims to do so. Does that make Wazzu a god to be worshiped and addored, while I'm simply some ignorant loser who needs to be beat with a physics stick? nope, difference of style and difference of purpous. Sorry to hijack the thread, but this bickering is both counter productive and annoying. It's a game, the reason for playing is to have fun, not to lord your l33t physics skills over people who both acknowlege and willingly kick your bailwick in the manhood.

but, thats just my oppinion, I admit I could be wrong.

The fact that you haven't read any of my RP's automatically makes point you have made had void.

Look in the mirror. You made the same claim...yet you haven't read any of my RPs. A bit hypocritical.

I don't claim physics beyond the most basic things and I don't believe I have the best of everything...however I purposefully play a very advanced nation, not a nation trying to be advanced. Because of this, I don't do war a lot, and don't try to throw my weight around.

If your playing at a Mishakal level, your not playing advanced (futuretech), your playing magic (magitech). That is, tech that has no basis in reality.

The triumvirate "wanks" all the time, yet rarely does anyone get on their case about it.

Yes, some (not all) Yut nations "wank" a lot, and yes, I for one have gotten on their case too.


However, this argument isn't and has never been about me using "pseudo-physics" or actual physics, so you "making it simple" is only you taking it off topic.

This debate is about what is respected. AO asked for advise, and I gave my opinion. I told him what I respected. You less then respectfully disagreed.

In a thread designed by AO asking for advice, you threw insults at me like I was some godmodding n00b, and then when I called you on it, continued with your bastard rant about how my RP's suck and no one gives me respect...only to say now that you've never read them.

I recall you threw the first insult. I stated that I had not seen any of your RPs, and that I didn't consider storefront threads or superships RP. You streached that arguement to absurdity to debate it.

AO, the creator of this thread, has said you are not wanted here. Unwanted posts are called spam. Take yourself and your spam elsewhere.

I'll stop posting here when I believe everyone has stopped twisting my arguements in order to flame me while making themselves feel better.

Peace gentlemen, Peace, it's a simple, unspoken fact that Wazzu is a member of the Hard Science Fiction community, and thus likes to play with others who follow Hard Sci Fi. Does that mean that Wazzu is right and people who don't do hard sci fi are heathens that need to burn at the stake for thier sins? No, it simply means that we put more emphasis on the Fiction than on the Science. Neither are inherantly wrong, or inherantly right, and both have upsides to them, but in the end it all boils down to one simple question. Are you having fun?

It's a game, and nothing more, which is a point a lot of people forget here, and like all games, it boils down to wether or not it's fun to play. Wazzu has fun playing in a more realistic sence, and working out physicis explainations for everything he wants to do, and that's fine for him. I on the other hand would prefer to have fantastic starships that could NEVER exist, play around with things that simply are too fantastic to ever be possible, and generaly don't have any alms bending the laws of physics to my whims to do so. Does that make Wazzu a god to be worshiped and addored, while I'm simply some ignorant loser who needs to be beat with a physics stick? nope, difference of style and difference of purpous. Sorry to hijack the thread, but this bickering is both counter productive and annoying. It's a game, the reason for playing is to have fun, not to lord your l33t physics skills over people who both acknowlege and willingly kick your bailwick in the manhood.

but, thats just my oppinion, I admit I could be wrong.

Taka, your attempt to calm this down is appretiated. However, like Steel, you are misinterpreting my aims.

I don't care if you use real physics or not, but if you don't, don't pretend to.

Nothing gets more annoying then two n00bs debating who's ships are better by using physics termonology, usually incorrectly.

"My 1km long ships have 50 MW lasers."

"Yea? Well my 1.3km long ships have twice as many 1 GW particle beams?"

"Oh yea? Well my ships also shoot 200 Gigaton anti-matter warheads at 99% the speed of light."

"Oh really? Well my ships use FTL to dodge, and their shields can take 5,000 of your anti-matter blasts."


Now, it isn't typically said that way. What happens instead is that people come up with starship statistics. And each time someone comes up with something, someone else will come up with something better...and usually cheaper (as most are in "buy these starship" threads). Thats why I call the ships "cardboard."

And this is the rut that I was trying to advise AO to avoid.

So again, thank you Taka for trying to calm things down, but I feel I am still misunderstood here.

Peace gentlemen, Peace, it's a simple, unspoken fact that Wazzu is a member of the Hard Science Fiction community, and thus likes to play with others who follow Hard Sci Fi. Does that mean that Wazzu is right and people who don't do hard sci fi are heathens that need to burn at the stake for thier sins? No, it simply means that we put more emphasis on the Fiction than on the Science. Neither are inherantly wrong, or inherantly right, and both have upsides to them, but in the end it all boils down to one simple question. Are you having fun?

It's a game, and nothing more, which is a point a lot of people forget here, and like all games, it boils down to wether or not it's fun to play. Wazzu has fun playing in a more realistic sence, and working out physicis explainations for everything he wants to do, and that's fine for him. I on the other hand would prefer to have fantastic starships that could NEVER exist, play around with things that simply are too fantastic to ever be possible, and generaly don't have any alms bending the laws of physics to my whims to do so. Does that make Wazzu a god to be worshiped and addored, while I'm simply some ignorant loser who needs to be beat with a physics stick? nope, difference of style and difference of purpous. Sorry to hijack the thread, but this bickering is both counter productive and annoying. It's a game, the reason for playing is to have fun, not to lord your l33t physics skills over people who both acknowlege and willingly kick your bailwick in the manhood.

but, thats just my oppinion, I admit I could be wrong.

I don't care how anyone wants to play. I agree...it's a game...and as a game...it should be fun. However Wazzu attempts to destroy the fun of others, and that should not and will not be tolerated.

Perhaps if you weren't so ready to flame, Wazzu, you wouldn't feel so "misunderstood." I've RPed with your type in the past, and was successful in doing so, although I did not like it, and have no intention to do it again.

I don't have physics debates with others and I don't have ship storefronts. Hell...the only storefronts I have sell pets, alcohol, and classic cars. (since I'm future tech, modern day mercedes-benz's are considered classic). You insult my RP's without reading them...you call me a 3rd world country without knowing anything about me or my nation...and you say I'm not respected at all while I could easily quote near hundred of people commending me on my RP's.

It just pisses me off...and it pisses off a lot of others as well. Just tone it down a bit, man.

*sigh*
Steel, I don't think I have anything.

*sigh*
Steel, I don't think I have anything.

Money then? Perhaps I'll just cut you a deal...I don't know...it depends on what kind of tech you want.

What did you have in mind?

*sigh*
Steel, I don't think I have anything.

Money then?

I got THAT! :D

And I would like uh........Weapons. Energy based, perferably.

what are you talking about?

what are you talking about?

Please, go read the FAQ's or start your own thread. You're new, so I'll go easy on you...but you shouldn't hijack someone else's thread.

*sigh*
Steel, I don't think I have anything.

Money then?

I got THAT! :D

And I would like uh........Weapons. Energy based, perferably.

There are many forms of energy-based weaponry. I have certain kinds, and I know of others. Do you have anything specific that you want?

There are many forms of energy-based weaponry. I have certain kinds, and I know of others. Do you have anything specific that you want?

no, not really. I have no idea what's out there.

AO:

I see no more point in argueing with Steel. The twisting of my words, ignoring of certain facts posted, and hypocracy is a seemigly invincible barrier to reason.

So I appologize for cluttering up your thread and for the misinterpretations between you and I.

Whatever Steel's next flame, I'll endeavour to make this my last post here.

I wish you happy RPing and hope you'll manage to stay out of the cardboard rut I mentioned.

Again, sorry for the debate.

-The player behind Wazzu

Hmm...any sci-fi shows that you want to emulate? Like...ST has phasers, disruptors, and an ungodly number of other things. SW has blasters...blasters...and blasters I think...

Hmm...any sci-fi shows that you want to emulate? Like...ST has phasers, disruptors, and an ungodly number of other things. SW has blasters...blasters...and blasters I think...

your the one who said that my tech was outdated. I'm guessing when you said that, you where reffering to my Plasma Cannons and Ion blasters.

Actually your weapons are not that bad...I was thinking more of your defensive capabilities.

Plasma isn't that effective as a weapon though...as it's more of a hot liquid than energy...

Actually your weapons are not that bad...I was thinking more of your defensive capabilities.

Plasma isn't that effective as a weapon though...as it's more of a hot liquid than energy...

ah....

Well....my Ablative Armor is extreamly thick, and can block attacks. The Sheilds are weak, I admit (then agian, I bought it from Kelnor).

Plasma: Ok....I guess I'll have to come up with a better secondary weapon.

Well..would you want more shield tech?

Well..would you want more shield tech?

sure. How much?

it's more "what kind" than "how much"

how do your shields currently work?

*Groans* Sorry, I feel a bit bad for butting in. :wink:

Firstly..... *Pokes AO* The nation name is Adejaani. It's a bit of a mouthful, but eh. Nobody can spell it anyway. :lol:

Second, to state for the record, Adejaani tries to (when designing tech/whatever product), tends to strike a balance between realism and "magic", as some called it. Magic as in "Any technology sufficiently advanced from your own could be considered magic."

For example, my new space fighter. It's overall "fuel" is water, which I'll use some fancy gizmo to turn into hydrogen and oxygen. The hydrogen goes into a fusion drive and the oxygen goes to the pilot. Add in a Trek like Buzzard Ramscoop, thus giving the plane virtually unlimited range, with restraints such as oxygen and ordnance balancing it out.

Third, stating for the record, I'm one of those that AO "consulted" (see first post in thread)..... And that I also need some space tech of my own. I'm willing to, pending Steel and AO's approvals, lend my support and brains to it. That is, if you're willing to deal with me. :wink:

Lastly, each to their own. I prefer reading the excitement, the battles and the personal side of each and every RP. And you don't have to go play with everyone, there's plenty of others who'll enjoy how you play. :wink:

it's more "what kind" than "how much"

how do your shields currently work?

I was refering to the price.

Anyway, it's basicly the same thing I said on the other thread. My sheilds can withstand energy weapons, but Missles and other projectiles pass right though it, which the Ablative armor deflects. It is devided up into several "sub-sheilds" (aka: if you hit the front, the back isn't effected)

Adejaani: heh. Not like I can spell anyway :wink:

And sure, come on in, I'm not stopping you.

OOC: Looking to develop some tech with another nation(s) (http://www.nationstates.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=133223)

Well...perhaps if you win the "contest"...and start developing something else...we could set up a trade agreement on all things.

Also, my shields deflect solid and liquid objects (not like ships though because of a number of reasons) but missiles are easily deflected, or if they explode on the shields, they have no effect.

For the shields, would it not be better to have something similar to a CIWS system? I thought of this idea a while ago for my Modern Tech forces. Let me explain briefly. A missile, say an AIM-120 AMRAAM, just use a low power laser to "burn out" the seeker head, say. If it's a heat seeker, just burn out the photovoltaic sell. No guidance, no threat.

I never went through with this due to expense and the immaturity of the tech in a Modern environment, but not future. So, if we're just dealing with energy weapons and we know what we're up against, we could theoretically send back energy, but of the appropriate wavelength, frequency etc to make us invulnerable, depending.

This doesn't make sense and yes, it's physics. Okay, let me explain simply. It's most simply thought of like, if you lean on a person, that person must lean back with the exact same amount of force or they'll fall over. If it's the same amount of force, then neither will fall. However, if that person applies more force, then you start to lean and you'll fall.

Energy works essentially the same way, if you can find its opposite, so in a sense, we can be invulnerable if we can change the energy we send back.