NationStates Jolt Archive

FHF (Fast Heavy Frigate) High Spirit Class Orbital Patrol Vessel

http://img11.photobucket.com/albums/v35/fredped/naritus.gif

Dimensions: 240 m ‘long’ from the complete tip to the last exhaust tip, 55 m ‘tall’ at tallest point, 35 m ‘wide’ at shortest point.

Acceleration: 12 m s/s

Fuel: Xenon liquid, ionized in engine. (Undecided, needs checking and/or other types of fuel)

Noncom crew quarters: 12 decks, 2.57 m per deck in height, 8 rooms across, 19 rooms deep, 4 halls across, total volume: 16735.0176 m^3

Com crew quarters: 12 decks, 2.57 m per deck in height, 4 rooms across, 2 rooms deep, 4 halls across (weapons lockers on either side, next to storage and hull. 2 hulls deep, outer hull and inner hull, basic surplus stored in space in between.) total volume: 493.44 m^3

Main command: 45 meters long, 25 m wide, 35 m tall at highest point 3 halls across, converging at command center at front lobe, actual command center area w/o accessories: 8 decks=20.56 m., 3 rooms per deck, one at front at 10LX10WX2.57H, two at back, 5LX5WX2.57HX each. Volume of entire main command area: 6562.5 m^3

Storage and etc. mods. =65 long, 32 wide, 40 tall (finished design undesignated). Total volume: 83200 m^3

Engine and etc. mods. = 32 wide, 73.17 long, 40 tall(does not include external exhaust parts.) total volume: 93657.6 m^3

Total volume of superstructure modules: 200648.5567 m^3

Weaponry: positions and power transfer areas undecided; most likely power plants will be in-between hull 1 and 2

First Hull: 2.00 meters deep, Second Hull: 1.5 Meters deep.

Decks: 200 mm thick, total masses per area:

Crew Quarters: 3347.00352 m^3 (20 cm thick, 28.56 * 49.83 * .2 * 12)

Storage Area: 33280 m^3 (4 m thick, 65 * 32 * 4 * 4)

Engine Area: 23414.4 m^3 (5 m thick, 32 * 73.17 * 5 * 2)

Command Area: 599.999999 m^3 (20 cm thick, [45 * 25] * 1/3 * .2 * 8)

These are spacecraft right?Can i build spacecraft for FP?We have thriving economy you know.

These are spacecraft right?Can i build spacecraft for FP?We have thriving economy you know.

It depends. Are you primarily a future nation or modern nation?
If you're a modern nation then one or two of those would probably eat up your entire military budget.
If you're an Earth-based future nation then you could probably have five, plus a very small conventional military.
If you're an extra-terrestrial (barring Mars) future nation then you could have a bit more, or some other ship classes.

(I'm guessing you worked from Santa Barbaras thread

Fuel: ionized hydrogen. (Undecided, needs checking)


If you´re going for realism, it would most likely be Xenon, and it`s liquid (or gas) for transport, ionised in the engine.

Also, if you´re going for realism, the thrust an ion engine gives you is extremely low (But so is the amount of fuel you need), means that your acceleration sucks (Not sure if your acceleration of ~ 1.5g is realistic... but it is most definitely ok in terms of balance. Could be higher, actually)

If you`re going for balance, rather than realism, it`s good.

For that matter, i would never construct a ship that detailed :shock: Too lazy for that... well, to lazy and not enough know how.

These are spacecraft right?Can i build spacecraft for FP?We have thriving economy you know.

It depends. Are you primarily a future nation or modern nation?
If you're a modern nation then one or two of those would probably eat up your entire military budget.
If you're an Earth-based future nation then you could probably have five, plus a very small conventional military.
If you're an extra-terrestrial (barring Mars) future nation then you could have a bit more, or some other ship classes.


Well, if you check military archives i have quite large conventional military, but we also have started(see incidents) a space program, but that aims for satellites.

thanks, and yes, i used s-b's thread.... a lot.... as in step by step.

and im changing a couple of things right now.

more changes in a few moments(i got the actual volumes now.)

It looks pretty realistic to me.

Xenon is one type of fuel used in ion/plasma engines, primarially because it is very dense.

No one has ever had any type of ion or plasma engine anywhere near 1 gravity in real life. Then again, no one has ever connected one to a nuclear power supply. Solar panels only provide a little energy, free energy, but only a little. 12m/s/s (closer to 1.25 gravities) is concievable, but you might have to do a little extra, like:

-Completely ionizing the Xenon gas. If you strip away all (or most) of its 54 electrons (instead of just 1-5), you'll get a lot more acceleration out of your engine. Of course, this takes quite a bit more power.
-Use a more complex particle accelerator. It could still be something simple though, like a cyclotron or a gaussian coil.
-Use fuel faster...all rockets (chemical, ion, fission, or fusion) can trade off between efficiency and acceleration to some degree.

But again, your ship looks pretty reasonable. Have you considered weapons yet?

Solid-state (LLED: Laser Light Emitting Diodes) are probably the smallest/least-massive (takes less fuel/energy to push) to mount. For an energy weapon, they don't take that much energy either. Then again, they don't do much damage. The US army is expermenting with putting them on lightly armored vehicles for missile defense and unexploded ordinance disposal. You could use them for missile defense and for taking potshots at fighters and large-ship sensors/communications arrays (by their nature very sensitive)...or for taking potshots at soft ground targets (like people).

Free-Electron Lasers are quite a bit more massive and take a lot more energy, but a ship with a nuclear power plant shouldn't have any trouble using them (the US Navy is looking at putting them on diesel powered destroyers and cruisers). They offer power into the low Megawatt range (rather then the solid-state laser's kilowatt range).

I don't suggest using chemical lasers, it isn't an efficient way to store fuel (but they are simplier then Free-Electron lasers and don't require power from your powerplant).

There is a whole variety of particle weapons you could use, most are fairly heavy. Cyclotrons are probably your best bet for a "light" particle weapon (lighter then a free-electron laser). Particle weapons will consume more power but do more damage then laser weapons, they will also have a shorter range (the similarly charged particles will repel each other). Charged particle beams also have a problem going through magnetic fields (like Earth's)...the fields change the direction of the beam making aiming harder. There are two ways to avoid this. Either use a neutral particle beam (neutralize the charge after the beam leaves the cannon by shotting electrons into it), or fire a laser along the particle-beam path a fraction of a second before/ahead-of the p-beam.

Plasma isn't an option in real life unless you stick it in a bottle. If you do that, the bottle will probably do more damage then the plasma. You may as well use....

A Coil (Gauss) Gun or a Rail Gun. Rail Guns will give you more efficiency and power, but you'll need to replace the rails after every 10-100 shots. These types of "electro-magnetic mass accelerators" will give you more velocity (so better range and damage) then a chemically fired bullet, but much less range then either a laser or particle beam. They are GREAT close-in weapons, and very good against relatively "stationary" (non-manuvering) targets...like satelites and spacestations. They are somewhat hard to aim though (gravity bends their trajectory...and acceleration due to gravity is different depending on where you are).

Missiles are of course the great fallback. Chemically propelled missiles should do well against any like-tech nation. If your fighting future-tech nations like Menelmacar though, chemical propulsion just won't do it...the ships are faster then the missiles. The problem with that is...fission and fusion powered missiles are not well regarded by the international community.


What you do will of course depend entirely on your nation's technological level in many different areas.

But I want to say again, what you have so far looks very reasonable (as long as you don't build hundreads within a real-life month or two). Very well done.

-The Cardboard Avenger


EDIT: Oh, and I like the pic! Be sure to keep your source secret so no one else will get others you may wish to use. :)

It looks pretty realistic to me.

Xenon is one type of fuel used in ion/plasma engines, primarially because it is very dense.

No one has ever had any type of ion or plasma engine anywhere near 1 gravity in real life. Then again, no one has ever connected one to a nuclear power supply. Solar panels only provide a little energy, free energy, but only a little. 12m/s/s (closer to 1.25 gravities) is concievable, but you might have to do a little extra, like:

-Completely ionizing the Xenon gas. If you strip away all (or most) of its 54 electrons (instead of just 1-5), you'll get a lot more acceleration out of your engine. Of course, this takes quite a bit more power.
-Use a more complex particle accelerator. It could still be something simple though, like a cyclotron or a gaussian coil.
-Use fuel faster...all rockets (chemical, ion, fission, or fusion) can trade off between efficiency and acceleration to some degree.

But again, your ship looks pretty reasonable. Have you considered weapons yet?

Solid-state (LLED: Laser Light Emitting Diodes) are probably the smallest/least-massive (takes less fuel/energy to push) to mount. For an energy weapon, they don't take that much energy either. Then again, they don't do much damage. The US army is expermenting with putting them on lightly armored vehicles for missile defense and unexploded ordinance disposal. You could use them for missile defense and for taking potshots at fighters and large-ship sensors/communications arrays (by their nature very sensitive)...or for taking potshots at soft ground targets (like people).

Free-Electron Lasers are quite a bit more massive and take a lot more energy, but a ship with a nuclear power plant shouldn't have any trouble using them (the US Navy is looking at putting them on diesel powered destroyers and cruisers). They offer power into the low Megawatt range (rather then the solid-state laser's kilowatt range).

I don't suggest using chemical lasers, it isn't an efficient way to store fuel (but they are simplier then Free-Electron lasers and don't require power from your powerplant).

There is a whole variety of particle weapons you could use, most are fairly heavy. Cyclotrons are probably your best bet for a "light" particle weapon (lighter then a free-electron laser). Particle weapons will consume more power but do more damage then laser weapons, they will also have a shorter range (the similarly charged particles will repel each other). Charged particle beams also have a problem going through magnetic fields (like Earth's)...the fields change the direction of the beam making aiming harder. There are two ways to avoid this. Either use a neutral particle beam (neutralize the charge after the beam leaves the cannon by shotting electrons into it), or fire a laser along the particle-beam path a fraction of a second before/ahead-of the p-beam.

Plasma isn't an option in real life unless you stick it in a bottle. If you do that, the bottle will probably do more damage then the plasma. You may as well use....

A Coil (Gauss) Gun or a Rail Gun. Rail Guns will give you more efficiency and power, but you'll need to replace the rails after every 10-100 shots. These types of "electro-magnetic mass accelerators" will give you more velocity (so better range and damage) then a chemically fired bullet, but much less range then either a laser or particle beam. They are GREAT close-in weapons, and very good against relatively "stationary" (non-manuvering) targets...like satelites and spacestations. They are somewhat hard to aim though (gravity bends their trajectory...and acceleration due to gravity is different depending on where you are).

Missiles are of course the great fallback. Chemically propelled missiles should do well against any like-tech nation. If your fighting future-tech nations like Menelmacar though, chemical propulsion just won't do it...the ships are faster then the missiles. The problem with that is...fission and fusion powered missiles are not well regarded by the international community.


What you do will of course depend entirely on your nation's technological level in many different areas.

But I want to say again, what you have so far looks very reasonable (as long as you don't build hundreads within a real-life month or two). Very well done.

-The Cardboard Avenger


EDIT: Oh, and I like the pic! Be sure to keep your source secret so no one else will get others you may wish to use. :)

thanks, and y would i give anyone my sweet looking ship site?

Since you don't seem to be aiming for anything excessively future-tech, I'd recommend fusion for your power generation purposes. Looks good to me - what are you making your armor out of?

dunno, but since im doing it really basically along santa barbara's thread, im thinking of titanium-aluminum alloy.

and an edit at the same time.

Perhaps the Foe Hammer Armada Technology Engineering Lab can provide you with working Fusion Engines and Plasma Power Generators for your spacecraft?

Once your ship is completed, we can also install our very strong, very secret Tubular Carbon Sheet Armor. It's at least ten times stronger than regular steel, and very light. However, it's a very hush-hush secret, so we're going to have to install it ourselves.

ok, sure, we can allow your engineers to enter the prototype construction site and install that stuff.

We are sending technicians and equipment from Sol Station to your Shipyards. Respectfully, we must request that all builders evacuate the build site, and all cameras be removed. The construction process is highly top-secret. However, we CAN simply send over a Tugger and haul the ship over to Sol Station, where we will install the components, weapons and armor, and send it back to your Shipyards.

do whatever you wish, what is most convenient, we want to get this into production.

Perhaps the Foe Hammer Armada Technology Engineering Lab can provide you with working Fusion Engines and Plasma Power Generators for your spacecraft?

Once your ship is completed, we can also install our very strong, very secret Tubular Carbon Sheet Armor. It's at least ten times stronger than regular steel, and very light. However, it's a very hush-hush secret, so we're going to have to install it ourselves.

OOC: This is called "carbon nanotube" armor, also often called "diamond" armor. Yes, very hush hush. So hush hush in fact that it is what 90% of starship makers use. Also called "common cardboard" in Wazzu.

No Foe Hammer, this is not a jab at you. I'm just pointing out that yes, the vast majority of people who make spaceships use this same thing.

*The Tug vessel emerges from Subspace and floats towards the Shipyards*

"Attention Holy Saint Shipyard, we are here to pick up the prototype of your new vessel for component installation."

*After 4 long hours, the vessel is sucessfully loaded into the hold, and the Tugship enters Subspace in a flash of green and blue light*

Perhaps the Foe Hammer Armada Technology Engineering Lab can provide you with working Fusion Engines and Plasma Power Generators for your spacecraft?

Once your ship is completed, we can also install our very strong, very secret Tubular Carbon Sheet Armor. It's at least ten times stronger than regular steel, and very light. However, it's a very hush-hush secret, so we're going to have to install it ourselves.

OOC: This is called "carbon nanotube" armor, also often called "diamond" armor. Yes, very hush hush. So hush hush in fact that it is what 90% of starship makers use. Also called "common cardboard" in Wazzu.

No Foe Hammer, this is not a jab at you. I'm just pointing out that yes, the vast majority of people who make spaceships use this same thing.

Well, Foe Hammer calls it Tubular Carbon Sheeting. And yes, I am aware that many people use it, however, the building technique involved in producing the sheets of Carbon Nanotube armor is a VERY top secret procedure that I won't even talk about OOC, because then someone will copy my idea and claim that one of their technicians thought of using that technique. Very hush-hush on both planes of reality.

---Post deleted by NationStates Moderators---

bump

im just wondering, how many of your posts are 'bump'?

jesbus...

48 of em are...

*Four days later, the massive Tugship returned, again floating towards the Shipyard*

*After 2 hours of unloading, the Tug captain advised the build supervisors on how to operate and maintain the Generators and Engines. After a quick test of the engines and few (thousand) S'mores for the Build crew, the Tug reentered Subspace, disappearing in a flash of blue light*

Transmission 132315763:

To: Foe Hammer Sol Shipyards:

From: THS Main Command, THS Shipyards

Ship has arrived, and again, thankyou for the services. what exactly is the payment?

We won't charge you anything, if you want to join The Hammerian Protectorate. If you join, you'll get more technology and ships, so it's a double-whammy there.

ah, excellent, is it a tech/trade alliance? cause then im all for it.

It's a tech/trade/defense alliance. If you want to join, go ahead and telegram me for the regional password.

ok, good(got a defense budget in the top 400...)

In return for the hundreds of billions, even trillions of dollars worth of technology, there is a yearly fee of 2% of your Defense budget (We changed it from 2% of your GDP a'cause that seemed a bit high). As soon as you join, you'll receive 10 Omaha-class Battleships and Fusion Engine technology, Advanced Shielding technology, etc.

OOC: Looks OK as far as realism goes for me. A+ !

If you're interested in things like fusion electric generators and such you might try the PrattCo Conglomerate (me). Although really there's nothing to prevent you developing your own, especially with all that money spent on defense. ;)

OOC: Looks OK as far as realism goes for me. A+ !

If you're interested in things like fusion electric generators and such you might try the PrattCo Conglomerate (me). Although really there's nothing to prevent you developing your own, especially with all that money spent on defense. ;)

thanks, and this thing is becoming a whole crapload more busywork than i thought it would be...

OOC: Looks OK as far as realism goes for me. A+ !

If you're interested in things like fusion electric generators and such you might try the PrattCo Conglomerate (me). Although really there's nothing to prevent you developing your own, especially with all that money spent on defense. ;)

thanks, and this thing is becoming a whole crapload more busywork than i thought it would be...

One thing that might help is standardizing modules. Weapons, engines, crew quarters, ratios, etc can all be standardized and that means you can just design chunks, and then put the chunks together differently to make different vessels. Especially if you're doing a whole fleet of ships and they all use similar weaponry, etc.

thats what im trying to do, just gotta finish the aux. bridge module, but i dont think ill standardize size, just deck size, etc, cause there are smaller and larger ships than this that im designing.

bumpo

(at school rite now, cant make changes.)

Simply remember, the more detail that you give out on your ship, the more likely someone will find fault with it...either in threads like these OOCly...or ICly on the battlefield.